Call me Crazy... (BD-Design)
by Bert 
, Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 16:16 (6107 days ago)
...which most people probably will after finding out what I am planning to do... 
The plan is to built the cleanest subwoofer possible which is obviously not small using 32 12 "woofers (16 per channel).
I just received the woofers and they look very pretty and suitable for some real deep bass, with real pressure without hearing anything....
Here is a reminder of the plan....time to get started building the thing! 
http://forum.bd-design.nl/index.php?id=13747
I will dedicate a page on my website for this subwoofer with pictures during building, measurements and additional comments from people who have felt them play...
Bert
--
BD-Design - Only the Best!
Before I forget to mention this again...
by Bert , Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 16:27 (6107 days ago) @ Bert
...the subs will be powered by the CrazyA's (2x 30Watt for bass configured).
More then enough power and control to drive this >112dB sensitive "thing"... :blrrr:
Bert
--
BD-Design - Only the Best!
Call me Crazy...
by PeterSt. 
, Netherlands, Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 19:01 (6107 days ago) @ Bert
16 per channel ... :biglol:
Are you physically organizing them for stereo playback ?
Peter
Call me Crazy...
by Bert , Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 19:14 (6107 days ago) @ PeterSt.
Hi Peter,
you physically organizing them for stereo playback ?
Yes, for sure! Even in the sub there is stereo information present.... 
A mono sub will cancel a positive and negative signal completely where with stereo there is still movement from one channel to the other channel. Not too critical in 99% of the recordings though but when it should be perfect then stereo it will be... :wink:
As I will be sitting in the middle of both channels this would be most accurate..
Bert
--
BD-Design - Only the Best!
Call me Crazy...
by PeterSt. , Netherlands, Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 19:17 (6107 days ago) @ Bert
Hi Bert,
Oh, I sure aree (why do I have two of them, hehe). I just did not see how you would be in the middle of the channels ... are you going to rebuild your room ?
Or maybe I'm wrong and you can spread them all over the whole width of the room already ...
Peter
Call me Crazy...
by PeterSt. , Netherlands, Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 19:18 (6107 days ago) @ PeterSt.
Oh, I sure aree
aree ... hmm ... where has the "edit" link gone ?
Call me Crazy...
by Bert , Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 20:57 (6106 days ago) @ PeterSt.
aree ... hmm ... where has the "edit" link gone ?
Should be there....? Or is it gone after some time?
--
BD-Design - Only the Best!
Call me Crazy...
by PeterSt. , Netherlands, Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 21:58 (6106 days ago) @ Bert
aree ... hmm ... where has the "edit" link gone ?
Should be there....? Or is it gone after some time?
I don't know ... it's just not there now. 
[img]images/uploaded/image52.png[/img]
Call me Crazy...
by Bert , Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 22:25 (6106 days ago) @ PeterSt.
Is it back now?
As Administrator I can always edit posts (any) so I was not missing the link... 
Thanks for the hint,
Bert
--
BD-Design - Only the Best!
Call me Crazy...
by PeterSt. , Netherlands, Thursday, August 02, 2007, 08:48 (6106 days ago) @ Bert
Is it back now?
Yep.
Call me Crazy...
by Bert , Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 21:41 (6106 days ago) @ PeterSt.
Or maybe I'm wrong and you can spread them all over the whole width of the
room already ...
Yep, that is the idea...no standing waves between the side walls this way too.
In a few weeks you can come over and have a massage... 
Bert
--
BD-Design - Only the Best!
Call me Crazy...
by PeterSt. , Netherlands, Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 22:03 (6106 days ago) @ Bert
In a few weeks you can come over and have a massage...
I'll bring my list of music with sub low information in it !
(and learn from yours)
I sure hope it succeeds. But knowing you, it will ...
Peter
Call me Crazy...
OK. You are crazy.
But the fact is there is very little difference between a crazy and a genious person. Science told me. or 
Bert, when once build we all have to start syncronising the play buttons and all play the same tracks at the same time. No one on earth can escape the woooooof from that wall. :wink:
Rudolf will not have to invest in a woofer at all and Peter can stay with his two boomers.
I will never ever watch a movie again in your cinema with that devil connected. I need both liver and kidneys to maintain my mortal body. 
GC (Former user of several Cerwin Vega Earthquake horns) 
Call me Crazy...
by Rudolf150 , Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 22:43 (6106 days ago) @ GC
Rudolf will not have to invest in a woofer at all and Peter can stay with
his two boomers.
Hi GC,
Yes, my wife will like this as well.
Everybody thinks that Rudolf150 stands for the lowest frequency, but it is the numbers of woofers I had in mind for my bass stack
I also understand now that Bert has given up the turntable, just imagine lower the needle in the groove and wait for the thumb 
The still-no-bass-Rudolf
Call me Crazy...
by leifchristensen , Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 20:35 (6106 days ago) @ Bert
just go for it...nothing to loose
and lots to gain
I am pretty surprised at how much my down under subs contributes to the complete sound of the entire freq range in my system,even when lowpassed at under 40 hZ
IMO
Best
leif
Call me Crazy...
by Bert , Wednesday, August 01, 2007, 21:01 (6106 days ago) @ leifchristensen
I know there is a lot to gain, at this moment I am using the horns as subwoofers below 30Hz but the timing is not accurata enough... (5.35m horn length) hence the reason for the change moving the radiating membrane(s) to the mouth of the horn...
Then I can delay what I need for perfect timing using a cheap but good working Behringer DCX2496..
Good thing is that most of the sub is already build....all it needs is a front panel!
Bert
--
BD-Design - Only the Best!
Call me Crazy...
Bert
i don't know if i missed it somewhere: what woofers will u use ?
Angelo
Beyma 12BR70 woofers....
by Bert , Thursday, August 02, 2007, 16:44 (6106 days ago) @ angeloitacare
Imagine 32 of those working at the same time....
Here is a link:
Bert
--
BD-Design - Only the Best!
Beyma 12BR70 woofers....
i've seen something similar in las vegas , in a 3d cinema. the woofers were hanging also on the ceiling, in a row. really impressive sound.
Beyma 12BR70 woofers....
i've seen something similar in las vegas , in a 3d cinema. the woofers were
hanging also on the ceiling, in a row. really impressive sound.
Yeah Angelo...
Heard such things in B-MAX omnidirectional cinemas. Huhaa...
In Copenhagen the numerous 18" woofers are contained in a 63 m3 vented enclosure. Whaaaaaah!
Well there it's not about fidelity, but more to get you captured between the visual illusion and the sound. But hell yes, it works as intended.
Just spoke with Bert to install 40 or 48 such woofers in my 4 corners. But before that I will go to Bert to hear what he acheived with his "wall".
If I like Berts set-up, I would probably like my own as well. Corner line source woofers serves both as a energy source for radiated or absorbers of reflected sound. The radiated is intended. The reflected is cancelled by the existance of the the woofers there. They will absorbe room energy build-up's in the bass as they caNot be rigid as a concrete wall. Vuola!
So forum... shal we explore the down under?
GC
Beyma 12BR70 woofers....
by Bert , Thursday, August 02, 2007, 21:27 (6105 days ago) @ GC
Hi GC,
So forum... shal we explore the down under?
First some practical things to consider, will it all be worthwhile? I mean to go extreme like I am making them now...
It is a good project to find out the true meaning of a subwoofer in general and learn something from that. My subs will only work below 35Hz as my Swings do a pretty good job already for musical experiences...
The present subs already do work extremely well below 35Hz though but then as a true horn using "only" one 15" driver per channel... this already is shaking the room but I am sure it will be better with the new approach having less drawbacks (from a technical point of view).
I just finished the major woodwork and created a nice DIY wood package (16 panels with 32 holes in total, 42 triangle panels for bracing and some additional panels to complete the package). With some luck I can have the constructions ready for placing them inside the horn mouth of my existing horns this weekend....
I'll keep you'll posted.
Bert
--
BD-Design - Only the Best!
How to get motivated...
by Bert , Thursday, August 02, 2007, 22:36 (6105 days ago) @ Bert
....see picture and you'll understand that my studio is full with stuff that needs to go out of the way!
I am highly motivated to finish the subs just by looking at this "load" already!
[img]images/uploaded/image316.jpg[/img]
--
BD-Design - Only the Best!
How to get motivated...
by PeterSt. , Netherlands, Thursday, August 02, 2007, 22:49 (6105 days ago) @ Bert
[img]images/uploaded/image53.png[/img]
Do not shake ?
LOL!
by Bert , Thursday, August 02, 2007, 22:58 (6105 days ago) @ PeterSt.
You're a funny guy Peter...
--
BD-Design - Only the Best!
Beyma 12BR70 woofers....
Yes Bert...
Your project and your approach to it as I know it, will definately show if it's worthwhile.
I have had many thoughts about reveiling the suttle information below 30 Hz on recordings throughout the many decades that passed my doorstep.
I have tried in many ways to expose it through funny systems. No one of them actually showed fidel trustworthyness. (Does that word exsist?). I got a boomy wavelike splashing low frequency blabrooffblawr... (That word does'nt exist for sure) kind of feeling. And for sure it doesn't exist in real life music.
The rooms I had couldn't cope.
On the other hand, when listening to the SWING's, what is it I need further?
Nothing...actually. When I compare real life clasical music to the replay here I definately need nothing further.
When listening to a synthisizer band, well...if he blows off a 15 Hz sub wave, I can't feel it that impresssive as maybe intended.
But don't forget Steen Duelund: The room adds a 12 db/oct belowe approx 80 Hz...very room size depending however. So we can control the room or we can let the room control us.
However it is...if the subs just stay quiet when nothing is told to them, it should be ok. And if something is dictated in that region, well we shall feel it.
Now only when it must be low distorted: Many many woofers. It can be a pleasure. It takes one to show one.
I saw organ pipes around which I would imagine should take a few m2 of moving mass and square meters to deal with #undistorted#. So it seems that's the way to look for improvements.
He he
GC